Wednesday, 6 November 2013

7 Simple Truths About Mike Vinson and the IWWB Fellowship

The following are 7 simple, straight-up truths about Mike Vinson and his IWWB fellowship. Ask yourself, as you read these, whether you can honestly believe that a ministry with this kind of track-record can lay claim to possessing "truth" to the exclusion of all other Christian denominations. The best indicator for future behavior of either a person, or a group of persons, is to look closely at the present and past. 

Please note, these are listed in no particular order. Links will open in new windows. 

1  Mike Vinson and Rob Jones (a former member) declared themselves "sinless" in 2005, publishing a paper on the IWWB website that purported to unlock the secrets of the book of Revelation. When Mike was confronted about the contents of this publication, and the pronouncement that he and Jones "no longer sin," Vinson staunchly and arrogantly defended it, and at the time, refused to repent, despite multiple admonitions to do so. Please see here and here for more information.

Although he since claims to have repented of this, in 2010 and again, in 2012, Mike Vinson window-dressed and re-packaged this very doctrine and declared in his IWWB bible-studies that he had been given "dominion" over sinning, and that sin no longer had power over him. Vinson explicitly stated: "But the day comes, when sin no longer has dominion over you.."

2  Mike Vinson and the IWWB group practice "shunning." This is where particular individuals are excluded totally from the group because they take issue with a doctrine or a matter of spiritual insight. This is no different to other religious sects such as the Jehovah's Witness, Mormons, and Islam, even though Mike has claimed that his group is nothing like any other Christian group. Mike Vinson has even extended this practice to his own family members and has arrogantly declared that they are "not part of the body anymore." Moreover, Vinson recently stated that those who have left, or who have been put out, should not be dealt with at all, even in a business sense. 

Vinson also used the marriage breakdowns of 2 former members to grand-stand and to illustrate, that these members were apparently experiencing the "discipline of the Lord" due to their rebellion against his teachings. Never mind the fact that an IWWB elder, Jason Martin, had his marriage do a nose-dive. Apparently, brother Jason is being "persecuted for the sake of righteousness" and being "hated of all men." The double-standards are appalling! 

3  Mike Vinson claims he is "easily en-treatable" but when evidence is provided that he has engaged in hypocrisy, or that he has sinned publicly, he does his best to deny it or to claim that others were responsible. Evidence of this can be found here, here, here and here

4  Vinson promotes an "us versus them" mentality, ranting and raging on a regular basis about the need to be "hated of all men." This catch-phrase has been lifted straight out of the WWCoG/Herbert W Armstrong lexicon and is a favorite of fringe religious sects, including IWWB. Vinson is very quick to tell his disciples that the "hate" will come primarily from family and friends, and that they should expect to be estranged from their loved ones, as they grow closer to Christ. See here, here and here for evidence of Mike Vinson's insistence that his disciples be hated by their family and friends.  

5  Vinson and his "elders" regularly use fallacious and circular logic when presenting their arguments. They move the goal posts when it suits them, lie about others, spin the rhetoric and misrepresent facts. When they realize they have been wrong, rather than openly admitting it in a humble fashion, their tactic instead is to "cook" (delete) any teaching from their respective websites and then act as if they never taught such a thing. Despite this, they claim that they possess absolute spiritual truth and that they are the only group Jesus Christ is actively working with. Mitchell Kuhn, in particular, has been caught out numerous times. Click here, here and here for more information on this. 

6  Only recently, Mike and his elders decided that "wages" were due from the IWWB disciples. They spent many hours, days and weeks providing a supposed scriptural basis/backbone for this, only to have it backfire on them! Mike, despite being an active participant in the discussion and saying: "we've cleared ourselves with the scriptures" later turned around and said that he was a "reluctant contributor" and that he wasn't the driving force behind the study. Please click here and here for evidence of this. The long since "cooked" dossier, the aptly titled "Funding God's Ministry" can be found here.

7  Vinson equates modern day societal practices with biblical counterparts. As an example, Vinson has stated that a nose-piercing is: "on the same spiritual plane" as ritual circumcision. Vinson has stated that if a man came into his fellowship with such a piercing, he would immediately judge him as "immature." Vinson has also said that Christmas is equitable with the Jewish rite of passover. Further, I am informed by Vinson's family that he also believes drinking a can of soda is equitable with smoking cigarettes.  

These truths are undeniable, and as demonstrated above, I make these claims having caught out the respective parties with their own published documents, along with audio and video. 

Given the track record here, do you honestly think the future bodes well for this ministry? 


  1. AY Yi yi, I just wasted about an hour on tryingthespirits on an article by someone named Mitch, called salvation for all. I gave it that much time trying to decipher what He was trying to say? As I give most information the benefit of proving itself. then I saw IWWB in another comment investigated an ended up here. I think You might appreciate the comment I left there, an here it is.(2Ti 2:16 NKJV) But shun profane and idle babblings, for they will increase to more ungodliness. who have strayed concerning the truth and they overthrow the faith of some. The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity. 1Ti 4:16 Take heed unto thyself, and unto the doctrine; continue in them: for in doing this thou shalt both save thyself, and them that hear thee.

    2Ti 3:12 Yea, and all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution. 2Ti 3:13 But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived. 2Ti 3:14 But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them; 2Ti 3:15 And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. Nothing May Be Added

    18For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book: 19And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.

    20He which testifieth these things saith, Surely I come quickly. Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus.

    21The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you all. Amen. {THE END.}

    Dear Mitch, While I'm sure You are well intentioned. I believe You might take Your own advice and try the spirits. A very thorough place to start is, it is very thorough an as I tell anyone. Don't believe everything You hear but, test the spirit of the information You receive. I also do not believe in eternal torment. But rather Eternal life in the Kingdom of God, or cast into the lake of fire to be instantly destroyed. Our Father is Truly a God of Love, but He is also Just. Shawn

  2. Hi, thanks for the comment.

    Mitch Kuhn is held up as a teacher within the iswasandwillbe faith. At one point, he was hailed as an elder, until I happened to point out that elders must be "the husband of one wife" according to scripture, not simply a single male as Mitch is.

    He, and another friend of his ("Dan") pronounced themselves as the 2 literal witnesses of the book of Revelation, sometime ago, when Mitch first met Mike Vinson.

    Mitch has basically endeared himself to Mike Vinson, whom he refers to as his "spiritual father." See here:

    Mitch has also been instrumental in the removal of people from the fellowship, where he takes the role of "bad cop." See this video here, where Mike and Mitch it seems, cannot agree on whether "days, months, times and years" is cause for removal from the IWWB body:

    Many people have also told me they believe Mitch is a closeted homosexual, which would not surprise me in the least. He is a rich young guy who hides behind the teachings of Mike Vinson and uses his position in the IWWB faith to exert dominion over others.

    Mitch also engages in outright fallacies in his teachings, lying to his readers on a regular basis. When he is caught out, he just moves the goal posts and carries on.

    You can visit my YouTube page for more about the lunacy of the IWWB movement - or you can listen to my SoundCloud page:


  3. Hey you are wrong Mitch is not a homosexual and he is a child of god. Do you know the verse that says there will be times that people will procecute you... Well mitch is the runner and you are the chaser.

    1. I was told by several individuals (independently) whom have known Mitch far longer than you, that they suspected Mitch is a "closeted homosexual." They said this based on their personal experiences with Mitch and their interactions with him over several years.

      I have never met Mitch personally and to be honest, I don't really care if he is a raging homosexual or not; it doesn't bother me one way or the other. What I do know is that Mitch and Mike Vinson are the "ringleaders of the simple-minded" and whilst they believe they have "the truth," the reality is that they are running a world-wide church of god splinter group that differs little from the hundreds of others out there.

      Mitch has been exposed on this blog as a hack biblical teacher (see my post, Mitch Kuhn ignores his own teaching) and his so-called "doctrines" are just recycled variants of those taught by father Herbert.

      The latest from camp Vinson and Mitch is that you cannot follow Christ apart from the mechanism of IWWB. In-fact, they removed several people from the fellowship who dared to express such a view. The group is a cult, and has been identified as: "a classic cult" by expert Rick Ross from The Cult Institute.

      Mike Vinson has been exposed on this blog as well, and he has been caught out lying through his teeth on many points. If you choose to associate with these sad excuses, then that's your business. I strongly suggest you seek the input of others and be wary of those who overtly state that they will be rulers and leaders of the world one day, as IWWB do.

      God bless

    2. I am sorry to say this, but you are were right all along... I am sorry...I wasn't in my right mind...

      You see, much has happened in the following year. I have been kicked out for...some things...


      Forgive me please.

    3. Hi thanks for commenting and no need to be sorry. The truth is, if you stick around IWWB for enough time, you will eventually see them for who they are - religious hypocrites and bigots who are simply recycling the teachings of Herbert W. Armstrong.

      Feel free to comment on what has taken place. God bless!

    4. Absolutely. I agree wit you that they are hypocrites. I just had to tell you that I am sorry for that message a year or so ago as my head was too far stuck up in Mike's biblical Teachings.

      I am away from them now. I don't know what to say really...It feels great! It feels great just to be free.

    5. Hi again. I'm so glad to hear that you feel "free" from these people. If this blog only helps one person, then that's reason enough for me. Take care and feel free to comment further on your interactions with IWWB if you feel comfortable in doing so. Cheers

    6. I would like to contact you again via email if that is possible. Would you mind sending it to me so that we can talk.

    7. Sure. Just reply here (to this comment) with your email and I will be happy to get in touch with you.

      Don't worry, all comments here must be approved before they are published. Your reply will be sent to me first, I will see your email and I will then delete the comment so it isn't published.


    8. this interaction is so fake hahahaha. Good one though.

    9. No it's all real. This person went on to post at Rick Ross "Cult Education Forum" late last year. Why don't you go check out what he had to say?

      You throw out the word "fake" -- how ironic. I can't think of anything faker than IWWB's version of Christianity.

  4. Thou shalt not judge...
    why were they telling you about him,..., hav you try meeting with him to help him out of the 'homosexuality' ...just hope Christ is looking at us smiling for this our 'reformations' while we do not have regard to the Law of Christ or the Spirit.

    1. Hello there, thanks for the comment.

      I'm not really sure what it is you're trying to say here mate...
      As I have mentioned before, the current crop of IWWB disciples appear to lack basic reading, writing and reasoning skills and you appear to be no exception.

      Seems rather odd that you are throwing up "thou shalt not judge" because that is exactly what IWWB do - they judge people based on looks, belief systems and more.

      Also, if you took the time to read anything above your own comment, you'd see I have said that I don't care either way if Mitch is a raging homo or not. That's entirely his business so why would I attempt (in your words) to "help him out of it..." How would you do that anyway? Fire up PornHub or RedTube?

      If you have something constructive to add to the conversation feel free to reply. If you're just a frothing Mike Vinson mini-me with nothing but IWWB and bible verses to quote at me then you may as well run along.


  5. I was just curious if you gentlement/landies still believe in the Scriptures or in a Creator?

    I am a prior Armstrongnite and believe with minor exception Ray was moved by God. Does the author have a website of any continual work?

    Just passing by

    Here is my email


  6. Howdy. Thanks for your comment.

    The website is only run by one person and presently, my belief is that yes, there may well be a creator. Like founding father Thomas Paine said, men write with words and ink, the creator writes with creation. The bible is a book written by men, who redacted, edited and adjusted it as they saw fit. It’s possible that the world we live has been written by a divine hand. To understand the creator we must study his work and this is where science comes in.

    The scriptures I liken to Jewish fables or fairy tales. They have merit from a literary and (a limited) moral perspective much like the story of Cinderella or Humpty Dumpty etc. however, there is little in the way of historical accuracy. Mike Vinson likes to say the bible is a history book but archeology and the sciences simply don’t bear that out.

    Consider that the gospels are anonymous documents where there are multiple disagreements on many of the details. There is also a lack of evidence that "Jesus of Nazareth" according to the gospels was even a historical figure. Even Paul the apostle never mentions anything that Jesus taught, nor anything about his supposed virgin birth. Ask yourself - why might this be?

    Re Ray Smith, I think like all biblical teachers he probably started off with good intentions. I will say that at least he wasn't fleecing people for money or flying around the world on other people’s dime like Vinson is. He served a purpose for many people (incl. myself) but he became a victim of his own celebrity and was so far off base with many of his assertions because he chose to elevate the bible to the status of a paper idol.

    No one man has “the truth” and anyone claiming to is likely suffering from mental illness or an over-inflated ego. The bible has some merits but it isn’t the answer to your life and experience tells me that 99% of the time, God doesn’t really give two shits about you or me and doesn’t have the time to answer prayers. He lets us reap what we’ve sown and work things out using the faculties he gifted us with in the first place.

    Hope this answers your question. Cheers

  7. To the people who say they are so sure Mitch is not gay, why would it matter? According to IWWB it's not sinful to be tempted, only to act on it. I once reckoned that Jesus could have been gay, which was promptly refused. I still don't know why. They preach sin is sin...that Jesus was afflicted in every way that we, Jesus could have been gay. The scriptures they use prove that it's a possibility.

    Your need to even bring up the hearsay of Mitch being gay really diminishes the seriousness of this blog. You could make all your points without the attacks. You are laughed at and seen as vindictive within the IWWB church. Your heated and condescending way of delivering a lot of this very valid information makes it easy for them to sweep you off as nutty and controversial. (By the way, when they laugh you off it feels very awkward and programmed)

    1. Hi. Thanks for the comment above. My “need to bring up the hearsay of Mitch being gay” is due to the spiritual environment in which Mitch is thriving, i.e. a fundamentalist cult where being gay is forbidden. It’s simply another contradiction lurking underneath the surface.

      It was also due to Mitch preaching and teaching that an elder was to be the husband of one wife while he himself was not and moreover, was apparently suppressing gay urges. It looks like that point was lost on you.

      As for how I am perceived in IWWB, why would I honestly give two shits about that? As if I care. Are you suggesting I censor myself in order to pander to Mikes brain dead group of sycophants?

      It’s my blog so I’ll say whatever I like and in the manner I choose to say it. I hope that’s clear enough for you.

    2. You may be interested to know that Mikes sons and another guy tried to lovingly reason with Mike and the fellowship some years ago. They did this via conferencing over the internet. I even have the audio file that I may post up one day.

      It was a total disaster. Mikes sons quoted verses that outright contradicted Mike and Mitch’s position. But that didn’t deter anyone from siding with IWWB and casting out those who legitimately bought their concerns in a non confrontational way.

      So I’ve seen how that approach goes. It doesn’t work. I’ve observed the sneaky way that people are dealt with. Spoiler alert: these people are mocked after the fact as well.

      Hope that clears things up for you.

    3. The tail end of that discussion is posted on the YT channel and is titled “Mike Vinsons Bandwagon Fallacy”

      This fallacy of Mikes is that so long as he and the appointed elders agree on a matter, it is settled as definitive doctrine. Mikes son bought up a range of points but in the end he was shouted down by an obese woman in the fellowship. What does that tell you about how serious these people are about the word of god?

  8. I talked in-depth with Mitch for many years and the homosexuality. It was evident to me by the questions he didn't ask that he wasn't gay. He even told me one day that he noticed a man being attractive as if it was out of the norm. I've even lived with Mitch for a few weeks and he gave every indication of white straight boy. He's talked a handful of times about noticing women. I think that, well I know, that Mitch is a deeply co-dependant individual. He derives his meaning by doing on and sacrificing himself to the service of others. He always has a patient. He told me that had it not been for taking care of an elderly woman in the church that he would have been "sucked into the world".

    1. Not sure why you're harping on about Mitch's sexuality. I've already stated I don't care about it. It's a total side issue and only has relevance from the point of view that Mitch is hailed as an "elder."

      Moreover, it was based on messages sent to me by those who had interaction with Mitch for longer than 2 weeks. However, I do think it's curious that with all the people in IWWB inter-marrying, Mitch has yet to find a suitable sheath for his sword.

      All the same, it looks like this is about the only thing you can attempt defend or pick a hole in?

    2. You harped about his sexuality with this blog, and I responded. You clearly are curious about Mitch's sexuality and see it as a valid reason to defame him. I'm very much against IWWB, but the tactic you're using here to challenge someone's credibility based on their sexuality is strange. Mitch being gay wouldn't make him a less credible leader. Psychological abuse, hypocrisy, contradictions, and other cult abuse would make him lose credibility. Jesus (if he existed) could have been gay. The IWWB teachings state that sin is just sin and doesn't condemn. I'm not saying I agree that one should repress their sexuality, though, whether hetero or homo..

    3. Again, I really don't care about Mitch's sexuality. It literally means nothing to me. It only matters from the point of view that Mitch is involved in a fundamentalist WWCoG splinter organisation, where being gay would sound the death knell for his teaching ministry.

      It's like the whole Ted Haggard thing -- the people making all the noise about "sin" and setting themselves up as "the elect" etc. are 9 times out of 10, the people who are attempting to compensate for something going on inside that they'd rather not face.

      Do I care about Ted Haggard being gay and having sex with a male hooker? Not at all. But it's the same thing with Mitch -- all the bloviating about elders being the "husband of one wife" etc. it does beg the question. If you can't see the point I'm making, then lets agree to disagree.

      As for your comment above re Jesus being gay, I think you might be onto something there. In my mind, it's entirely plausible.

    4. Also, re your comment about "sin is sin" and that IWWB don't discriminate, I find that incredibly hard to believe.

      Are you saying that Mike would allow someone to teach who openly admitted they were gay? Mike has already said that if someone came into the fellowship with a nose ring, he would immediately judge that person as a weak immature babe in Christ. How much more if someone openly said "Hey Mike, just wanted to level with you in that I fantasise about sucking dick, but don't worry, I won't be acting on it -- this is just my thorn in the flesh"

      Back in my time there, Mike flamed a guy who was having a hard time getting off pain medications as a weak immature babe so again, I can't see how he'd be open to allowing a gay man to teach. Feel free to correct me if you think I'm wrong on that. Cheers